Download "Tales of Kenzera: ZAU's Director Explains The Metroidvania's Spirit"
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00:00:07
hello and Beyond Tales of Kera is the00:00:10
gorgeous new action platformer from00:00:12
sergeon Studios and ABA Saleem who is00:00:15
here to tell us all about it himself hey00:00:17
Abu what's up what's going on for that00:00:22
was really cool that was you know you00:00:24
know it's so funny every time I get00:00:26
introduced I'm always a bit like oh boy00:00:28
oh boy it's real oh boy00:00:32
real it's so honestly it's it's very00:00:35
surreal because again like the game was00:00:37
such a secret for so long and now like00:00:40
normally I'm used to people being like00:00:41
Oh yeah it's a boo from Raised by Wolves00:00:43
or a boo from a TV show now it's like00:00:45
that you're saying the name of the game00:00:46
I'm like oh it's it's it's00:00:49
coming yeah this this is this is on you00:00:52
this time like you can't you know you00:00:53
can't just blame all the other people00:00:54
you worked on or get the praise it's00:00:56
it's not you know like you did this with00:00:58
the studio it's it's a small it's a00:01:00
small team working on this but like yeah00:01:01
you're front and center man so no you00:01:03
know no00:01:05
pressure every time someone says no00:01:07
pressure it's like oh that that means00:01:09
pressure doesn't that means real00:01:11
pressure um so yeah tell tell us a bit00:01:14
about the you know the kind of the story00:01:16
behind this game because you you you00:01:18
you've been known for acting and00:01:19
performance capture and voice acting um00:01:22
and then you're like I I want to make a00:01:24
Metroid Vania like that I there's you00:01:26
know like Tom Cruz isn't out there being00:01:28
like you know what I got to do I got00:01:29
going to make a a 3D collectathon for00:01:31
the N64 like I love this about don't bro00:01:34
you don't know okay honestly I wouldn't00:01:37
surprise me it wouldn't surprise00:01:40
me tell us about Tales of Kera yeah so00:01:45
so Tales of kzer really came about um as00:01:49
it was it was a way of essentially00:01:52
processing my grief um I lost my father00:01:54
10 years ago and it was one of those00:01:55
ones where for a while I've it it was00:02:00
tough right it's it's always tough I00:02:02
mean like the best way I can describe it00:02:04
is like it wasn't really part of the00:02:06
plan so it kind of took me by surprise00:02:08
and and I think you know for 10 years I00:02:12
you know I've been kind of going through00:02:13
this whole journey as a as a whole and00:02:16
four years ago I decided actually you00:02:17
know what I I think I know how I can00:02:20
process an element of it and it has to00:02:22
be through a video game um it it was one00:02:25
of those ones as well where00:02:28
like death in our family is so common00:02:31
like so common because we're so big but00:02:33
when it comes so close you or it just00:02:36
takes you back a bit so yeah the game is00:02:39
you know it's it's inspired by sort of00:02:41
the banto myths and and and legends you00:02:43
know lots of stories that my father00:02:45
would tell me as a kid um you know the00:02:47
reason why it's I'd say this the reason00:02:49
why it's a metroidvania is because I00:02:51
think that's the the perfect genre to00:02:53
sort of depict grief in the sense that00:02:56
you're thrown in the middle of something00:02:57
you have no idea about and you've got to00:03:00
you work it out as you go along you know00:03:03
the longer you spend in it the more00:03:04
comfortable you get you know and that's00:03:06
essentially grief man and so that's kind00:03:08
of you know why it's why it had to be a00:03:10
Metro Vania and you know the 2.5d00:03:13
sidescroller element is because I used00:03:14
to play Sonic with my dad and like that00:03:17
you know that kind of feeling I wanted00:03:19
to kind of capture in this in this00:03:22
game that man I'm sorry you just you00:03:25
just completely blew my mind with like00:03:27
the Metro Advia is a good genre to00:03:30
process death uh that i' I've grieved00:03:33
before and like that's just like I mean00:03:35
that that you just opened a door for me00:03:36
which is what those games are about00:03:38
really like man yeah I needed a second00:03:40
there damn that was really good um like00:03:44
no I was just gonna say like you know00:03:46
the thing is it's it's one of those ones00:03:48
where every time I've sort of played it00:03:50
there is this weird isolated feeling00:03:52
that you get from it right that you're00:03:54
kind of journeying through this thing00:03:55
it's your own experience and you know00:03:57
the abilities that you find you find it00:03:59
in your own time and I think like that00:04:01
that's basically grief man like it's you00:04:03
know you find a way to deal with there's00:04:06
no sort of right or wrong way there's00:04:08
only your way and I think like that's00:04:10
essentially what a Metro vainer is00:04:13
That's So like on point because you know00:04:15
you I I've lost family members I think00:04:17
we all have and you know you you get00:04:20
past one hump and you're like okay I'm00:04:22
doing better and then something else00:04:24
hits you and then you're not expecting00:04:26
it and you've got to figure out how do I00:04:28
move past this now how do I you know how00:04:30
do I deal with this how do I process00:04:32
this so that's just super powerful like00:04:34
spot on like I've never had anybody like00:04:37
connect Metro vanas to that but like you00:04:40
should be teaching Game Theory man like00:04:42
like that's like that00:04:46
was I like I've I've I've used video00:04:49
games to to process death like God of00:04:51
War specifically the um yeah the00:04:54
rebooted one um but I'd never thought00:04:57
about sort of like taking that and00:04:59
turning it00:05:00
into making something while also00:05:01
simultaneously immortalizing a lost one00:05:04
which you're which you're doing here um00:05:06
yeah no that's it's just like such an00:05:07
awesome story um it's I guess it got me00:05:11
thinking too like what's interesting00:05:13
about what uh Tales of KERO is doing is00:05:15
that it it sort of lets you like right00:05:18
off the bat right at the start of the00:05:19
game one of the first things that struck00:05:20
me was like you get you get a double00:05:22
jump and an air Dash and your your00:05:24
combat feels good and not necessarily00:05:27
evolved because you learn more and more00:05:28
stuff but like it it throws you right in00:05:31
with like a lot of maneuverability and a00:05:33
lot of like this sort of ancient classic00:05:35
Metroid V I mean literally Metroid it00:05:37
takes so long to get any sort of00:05:40
semblance of like I got some speed all00:05:42
right finally I got a wall jump okay00:05:43
cool like you're like a couple hours00:05:45
into the game but what entails a gon era00:05:46
like you're I'm like oh crap I got a00:05:48
double jump and an air Dash immediately00:05:50
I see this thing really far from me I00:05:52
can already get to it so um was that was00:05:55
that something that you guys you thought00:05:56
about like I I want to I want I want I00:05:59
want this to be quick right off right at00:06:00
the gate yeah because again it's it's00:06:02
that whole thing of again just so the00:06:05
thing is right we're like a we're a00:06:06
small team so we've got to really sort00:06:08
of make sure that every decision counts00:06:10
we don't want to uh you know make it you00:06:12
know make a choice and have to Pivot00:06:14
because that will take us ages but00:06:16
really you know from the get-go I said00:06:18
you know I want these abilities these00:06:20
fun abilities that you kind of get00:06:21
because again in life you know I was00:06:25
thrown into this sort of deep end but00:06:27
I've it's not like I'd kind of you know00:06:29
come a new00:06:30
it's like I had I've had experience I've00:06:31
had previous experience past experience00:06:33
and I think like that's the best way of00:06:35
again you know respecting the and res00:06:38
and you know kind of communicating00:06:41
essentially like Zhao the character has00:06:44
you know he's living his life he's you00:06:46
know he's got history he's got a past00:06:49
double jump Dash you know all that kind00:06:51
of you know attacks and wall jumps like00:06:53
this is his past and like rather than00:06:56
give the you know the the player nothing00:06:58
from the get-go it's like no this is00:07:01
this is what you've got you've got to00:07:03
you know now go ahead on your journey00:07:04
and deal with it and I think like that's00:07:06
that was something that again to really00:07:09
kind of capture and and and sort of00:07:11
communicate that element of grief in an00:07:13
honest and truthful way you have to00:07:15
throw someone in the deep end but with00:07:17
at least some tools that you kind of00:07:19
expect them to have you00:07:20
know no I I respect that and I00:07:23
appreciate it too as someone who plays a00:07:24
lot of Metroid vanas it was awesome to00:07:26
just like immediately hit the ground00:07:27
running and be like Oh I got some I got00:07:29
some power and some speed let's let's00:07:31
kick some butt mhm yeah speaking of huge00:07:34
Metro vanus can you tell us a little bit00:07:35
about what it was like not only making00:07:37
one but making it one is your first game00:07:40
like what did you want to get right like00:07:42
overall00:07:44
Asia I think I think my team were00:07:46
literally like of all the games to make00:07:49
as a first one man why00:07:52
[Music]00:07:54
metania yeah you could have done like a00:07:56
match three puzzle game they would have00:07:57
been like oh that's a little easier we00:07:59
got you00:08:01
know visual novel like man you know and00:08:05
the community like they care right the00:08:08
Metro Community yo we if you're gonna00:08:10
make it like step up like don't don't00:08:13
come in and say you're just gonna make00:08:15
something no it was um it was it was00:08:18
good it was tough because I think like00:08:19
the the the elements of having to00:08:22
balance a lot and play with a lot and00:08:24
think about the journey and think about00:08:26
pacing of story I think matching story00:08:28
with a metro genre like I can totally00:08:31
understand why not many games do it00:08:32
because there's so much you know there's00:08:34
so much to explore there's so much to00:08:36
see and to be able to kind of keep the00:08:38
pacing of a story going in that kind of00:08:41
space is very hard so it's like you know00:08:44
we really had to manage and maneuver a00:08:47
lot of things at the same time and again00:08:50
like the the team as well like the the00:08:54
journey has been you know starting a00:08:55
studio making our first game forming our00:08:58
team for the first time so we don't even00:09:00
know each other and we're having to00:09:02
figure out how we're going to work with00:09:04
one another like it's been and it's been00:09:07
such a journey in regards to kind of00:09:09
conjuring this experience at the same00:09:11
time you know we're dealing with covid00:09:13
or we're dealing with other elements you00:09:15
know and it's like oh right I'm learning00:09:17
what it means to to run a business I'm00:09:19
learning what it means to to write a00:09:21
script like it's there's so many00:09:23
learnings out of this whole thing but00:09:26
truly I think the one thing that's been00:09:28
really lovely is that we all been driven00:09:31
by this mentality of wanting to tell an00:09:34
honest and truthful story and I think00:09:37
like that has really driven us to to get00:09:39
to where we are now to like you know to00:09:41
the to the end goal to actually shipping00:09:43
a game it's been00:09:45
really beautiful to kind of watch us00:09:48
just grow and and and strengthen and and00:09:51
become become a team become a studio you00:09:53
know so yeah the Metro Vania genre is00:09:56
definitely a tricky and tough one but00:09:58
I'm I'm glad we had something that00:10:00
needed that maneuvering because it00:10:02
required us to focus and work as a team00:10:05
a lot more delicately and carefully you00:10:08
know right and you were you know you've00:10:11
been doing uh acting performance capture00:10:14
voice acting all this stuff uh for years00:10:16
now you were the main character in00:10:18
Assassin's Creed Origins like was was it00:10:20
was it like something where you were00:10:23
part of a contribution to a game where00:10:25
you're part of a game development right00:10:27
um that made you go like hey I want to I00:10:29
want to dig in deeper and and see like00:10:31
what this whole thing feels like to kind00:10:33
of take on every element of it it was00:10:36
it's funny I think so Assassin's Creed00:10:37
Origins just it sort of made me realize00:10:39
that even though I've been playing games00:10:41
all my life like I love games but like00:10:43
the fact is that with Assassin's Creed00:10:44
it made me realize that you could have a00:10:46
job in games which is crazy because I00:10:48
never thought that you could actually00:10:49
you know I didn't really realize that00:10:50
there were people behind these things00:10:52
making them I I kind of thought you put00:10:53
like a CD and the PS2 and Gremlins or00:10:57
something make it happen like I know00:11:00
like really truly the realities of it00:11:02
all but what Assassin's Creed did was it00:11:04
introduced me to players or players and00:11:07
developers who love games who just truly00:11:12
love the creation process as well as00:11:14
playing them and I think like it was00:11:16
really it's so different from like00:11:18
working on a TV or a film set where a00:11:20
lot of the time you know people are00:11:21
there to just do a job and then they go00:11:23
home like that's it whereas in games it00:11:25
feels like there is this passion like00:11:27
everyone's an artist and they really do00:11:29
care about what they're doing and what00:11:31
they're bringing and I think like that's00:11:33
what I really loved being around I was00:11:35
also a massive Assassin's Creed fan so I00:11:37
was constantly when I wasn't filming00:11:39
which was very rare I was in the offices00:11:42
testing the game playing the game and00:11:44
seeing what it was like and asking00:11:46
questions because I'm I'm I'd asked too00:11:48
many questions like I'm very very00:11:50
inquisitive because that's the only way00:11:51
I can learn essentially right and so for00:11:54
me you know that kind of opened the my00:11:57
eyes to it all but it was only until00:11:59
until like what three three years I00:12:01
think later until I decided like00:12:04
actually this is this is what I want to00:12:06
do and I know Ubisoft isn't necessarily00:12:09
the best team to kind of like or you00:12:11
know option because there's like00:12:12
thousands and thousands upon people00:12:13
we're only like 30 so it's like such a00:12:16
different beast but it really did00:12:19
inspire me and especially Montreal00:12:20
Montreal's got a real lovely energy00:12:23
about um game development there that I00:12:25
think it's very00:12:27
infectious yeah really cool I I'm glad00:12:30
you weren't like you know what I got to00:12:32
do is start a global studio with like 1600:12:34
different oh my God00:12:38
absolutely Lord oh my God your passion00:12:42
like it's it's I've been watching this00:12:44
game since I think it debuted at game00:12:45
awards last year and then we had it we00:12:48
had a segment I think for FanFest this00:12:50
year um and then like I got to meet you00:12:53
at GDC and like your passion for this00:12:56
project in this game is just like it00:12:58
it's what took this game like I want to00:12:59
play that too like this is a day one00:13:01
play for me I need to play this as soon00:13:03
as it drops and nonstop and like you00:13:06
know I I've played through it at this00:13:08
point and I didn't stop and once I00:13:10
started like legitimately like I just00:13:13
couldn't put it down um and you know00:13:15
that's that's a little bit to do with my00:13:17
like addictive personality of like when00:13:18
I start something I want to play it all00:13:20
the way through but I was engrossed00:13:22
through the whole way through for this00:13:24
like passion it it's it's showcased00:13:26
everywhere in this game the from the the00:13:29
music to the scenery the the the art00:13:32
just everything it just it screams just00:13:35
authenticity and passion like you know00:13:38
how how important was it for you to kind00:13:40
of nail those aspects especially because00:13:42
this isn't a location that we often see00:13:45
um in games I mean you know for me it00:13:48
was it was very much the sense00:13:51
of if I I kind of had this mentality and00:13:54
I think a lot of us did like you know we00:13:56
only have one chance to essentially uh00:13:59
do this right so if we really want to do00:14:01
this right like let's let's let's do it00:14:04
right and I think for for for us it was00:14:07
very00:14:08
much00:14:10
again so I've I've always kind of led by00:14:12
this this this thought as an actor of00:14:15
and it was taught to me by a by a00:14:16
teacher who essentially said like you00:14:18
know a lot of the time whenever you do00:14:20
something or you give yourself to00:14:21
something uh the audience who are00:14:23
receiving it there's always going to be00:14:24
someone in the audience who's going to00:14:25
receive it for the first time and00:14:27
there's always going to be someone in00:14:28
there is going to receive it for the00:14:29
last time and that really stuck with me00:14:32
and I remember thinking to myself okay00:14:35
so if I do do something I've got to00:14:38
either show that person who's come in00:14:40
for the first time like hey you you're00:14:41
going to want to see more of this but00:14:43
also ensure that the last you know the00:14:45
person who might see it the last time00:14:46
due to either a tragedy or whatever like00:14:48
they get a good experience and so it00:14:51
needs to be authentic it needs to be00:14:52
honest it needs to be truthful and so00:14:54
like there you know that's always been00:14:56
our sort of Mantra at the studio from00:14:58
the get-go it's like you know we've got00:14:59
to be honest and authentic it's got to00:15:01
be about the human truth about like what00:15:03
makes us human because that's what's00:15:05
exciting rather than necessarily you00:15:07
know you know it it this I guess the00:15:10
thing is it's like focusing on00:15:11
authenticity and and truthfulness it it00:15:14
goes beyond sort of like race or gender00:15:17
or or or anything like that it it just00:15:20
connects us and I think like that was00:15:23
what was driving us with this game and00:15:25
what really drove me to tell the story00:15:27
like I didn't want to you know the the00:15:29
reason being for this telling the story00:15:31
yes it was it was inspired by my father00:15:34
but it's also inspired by this journey00:15:36
that I went through that I wanted to say00:15:38
like hey to everyone else like you're00:15:40
not alone like we're all going to go00:15:42
through something like this even though00:15:44
it feels isolating it's not always the00:15:46
same way like you're not going to come00:15:48
to an end point and be oh it's I'm00:15:50
accepting it all like that's not how it00:15:51
works and you know you might feel angry00:15:53
sometimes you might even feel happy00:15:55
sometimes and that's totally fine like I00:15:57
think like that's what we was really the00:16:00
the sort of it was the fuel for for00:16:02
creating this thing and and and being00:16:05
and you know wanting to share it is00:16:07
ensuring that we're giving an authentic00:16:09
experience to people so it's funny it's00:16:11
like I always say this if it wasn't so00:16:14
personal I think I probably would have00:16:16
quit after like the first00:16:19
year game hard it's I00:16:24
mean I like I I I understand that like00:16:27
you know game games are a business right00:16:29
like they are they are the intersection00:16:30
of of Art and and and money and like00:16:33
somebody you do have to sell a product00:16:34
at the end of the day but like I I I00:16:36
really hope people hear your story here00:16:38
and they and they really recognize that00:16:41
people generally get into game design00:16:43
and game development because they they00:16:45
give a they're passionate they00:16:47
really truly care and like um I I I I00:16:50
love that for man I just I love that00:16:52
you're making something that you care00:16:53
about I hope your studio keeps making00:16:56
games like this for for decades and00:16:58
decades and you get00:16:59
you know one day OB your dream of00:17:01
running a global studio with thousands00:17:04
of offices all00:17:06
over oh my God man like I'm good I'm00:17:09
good I'm good but um yeah no Abu thank00:17:12
you so much man like thank you for00:17:14
joining us today and for telling us00:17:15
about your game uh it's coming a a00:17:18
PlayStation Plus extra and premium so00:17:20
all of our PlayStation fans that listen00:17:22
to the show you can get it right there00:17:23
um that's April 23rd right yeah April00:17:27
23rd it's00:17:31
it's almost here go get Tales of K00:17:34
kenzer uh on every platform but also on00:17:37
PlayStation and uh plus and premium on00:17:40
April 23rd thank you so much man and00:17:43
congrats on the launching your game and00:17:45
good luck for years to come thank you00:17:47
thank you for having me guys all I see00:17:49
before me is a boy a desperate boy the00:17:53
desperate bleeDescription:
Tales of Kenzera: ZAU, the upcoming Metroidvania and debut game from Surgent Studios, is inspired by Bantu cultures and the creative director's experience dealing with grief. Jada Griffin and Brian Altano sit down with Tales of Kenzera: ZAU's Abubakar Salim to discuss the his journey while making the game.
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Which format of "Tales of Kenzera: ZAU's Director Explains The Metroidvania's Spirit" video should I choose?
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