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Russian
00:00:00
[music]00:00:12
[music]00:00:18
Hello My name is Vladimir Shushkin and00:00:20
today we are talking about the Kazan phenomenon,00:00:22
this is a rather interesting phenomenon00:00:25
associated with the last00:00:27
decades of the Soviet Union, let's say, when00:00:29
Kazan was actually flooded with00:00:31
teenage gangs, then00:00:34
they were not called criminal very00:00:36
often and Robert is with us today Garayev00:00:38
is the author of the book The Boy's Word Hello, I'm Robert00:00:41
Garayev and I would really like to00:00:43
say a small disclaimer right away, I don't drown00:00:46
for the boys' behavior. There is such an erroneous opinion00:00:50
that since I'm dealing with the topic of groups, it's00:00:52
as if I supported sealing the00:00:55
criminal lifestyle, this is not so. As a00:00:57
researcher, I dissect It’s important for me00:01:00
to know why this happened. Just then,00:01:03
why in Kazan, but to00:01:05
express some sympathy for someone. Well,00:01:08
criminals are not really my task. That00:01:11
is, this00:01:14
was an additional group. I know how I can be00:01:17
false there if someone tries, for example, in an00:01:21
interview to lie to me. I can actually say that’s how it00:01:23
most likely happened.00:01:25
It’s just like a researcher gives an00:01:26
additional lever. It’s not like I’m drowning00:01:29
for boyish things; it’s not alien to all this; I’m not00:01:32
drowning for world peace, in fact.00:01:34
Well, I’m against people beating00:01:37
each other up. on the streets but that’s not my thing I’m00:01:40
more of a bohemian and musician, that is, it00:01:43
seems to me that people should be friends and not them beating up,00:01:46
especially teenagers, the00:01:49
essence of the Kazan phenomenon is that as00:01:53
I formulate, that in fact the entire00:01:55
city was divided into teenage00:01:57
groups, that is, which00:01:58
were formed in many ways when,00:02:01
according to you, at first they were not engaged in00:02:02
some kind of criminal activity, how did00:02:04
this phenomenon arise, if not00:02:06
looking back to very ancient times and00:02:08
wall-to-wall fights of Chaliapin? But in the00:02:10
70s, how were they not engaged in criminal00:02:13
activity, which was radio such00:02:16
profit in large formats because well,00:02:20
how to take away the little things from schoolchildren, it00:02:23
was always there, and before the groups00:02:25
it was not only in Kazan. It was00:02:26
everywhere now,00:02:28
in fact, the story is simply on the00:02:30
wall of Soviet cities, both small and00:02:34
large; it was also common for the whole00:02:36
country. That’s where- then it was a little00:02:39
stronger, but it00:02:42
was practically all subject to the difference, the00:02:44
rendering was probably just00:02:46
Kazan. It was exaggerated,00:02:48
both adventure and multiplied by two00:02:51
or 3 at once. Well, that is, there are 10000:02:53
groups in the city, people are doing00:02:56
only this huge a problem for the00:02:58
eighties, these guys killed their00:03:00
peer, beat them with sticks in a group00:03:02
fight, he was a stranger from another group00:03:06
and also went to kill, but he was unlucky, they00:03:11
are called gopniks, they00:03:13
have their own territory, their own principles, their own00:03:17
philosophy, the beginning of the eighties is still the00:03:19
Soviet Union of the00:03:21
era of stagnation, not even Perestroika in during00:03:23
perestroika they were simply allowed00:03:25
to talk about it. Well, 88, the very height of00:03:27
perestroika, Ogonyok writes about the fact that this is00:03:30
happening in Kazan. But in fact,00:03:32
Moscow at that time already knew very well00:03:34
about the Kazan groupers, in any00:03:37
case, Moscow teenagers because00:03:39
somewhere in 87 such people began to travel teams of00:03:43
flocks from Kazan Naberezhnye Chelny00:03:45
Almetyevskoye for the weekend for a couple of days00:03:48
to Moscow in order to take away00:03:49
some branded items sneakers00:03:52
Olympic jerseys of Alaska00:03:54
to take money and quickly go back00:04:00
got out and hit with a stone for00:04:03
several years it was just such an00:04:05
epidemic it was scary they say that00:04:07
even The Kazan station was somehow closed00:04:10
because several thousand of00:04:12
these teenagers gathered there; Muscovites also didn’t00:04:15
like it;00:04:19
groups formed in the early00:04:21
seventies, I understand correctly, you know,00:04:23
there was evidence of the forties and00:04:25
fifties in these settlements there were people00:04:27
who also fought wall to wall.00:04:29
Well, at some point it’s difficult00:04:30
to say exactly when exactly, seventy-00:04:32
nine, eightieth, the groups suddenly have00:04:35
some certain features of00:04:37
such strong discipline that before00:04:40
this there was no division into age and00:04:42
punishment for smoking and taking alcohol00:04:45
and drugs, a serious punishment and training camps00:04:48
every day, that is, something like that00:04:50
militarized, they become fighting00:04:52
brigades. Perhaps this was due to the fact00:04:55
that there were many of them. There was00:04:56
some kind of hierarchy within, yes, that is, within one00:04:59
large group, age expenses are00:05:01
hierarchical. That is, the lowest ones are a00:05:04
shell, then the super age00:05:07
is called young middle senior00:05:09
old people, then somewhere- then the author00:05:11
The leader of the group returned00:05:15
to the period of formation When you say00:05:17
that you control the road and00:05:20
you control the street there, but at what point at00:05:22
any time there is a group of boys00:05:24
who think that they need to punch00:05:26
another group of boys in the face, but at00:05:28
some point Why suddenly They00:05:29
they understand that they need to control00:05:31
this street. How does this00:05:33
understanding arise? Why are they sitting in00:05:35
the yard with your boys kicking the ball out?00:05:37
Well, then the neighbor came running and decided to00:05:41
break your head. You see this is what they are, these are the00:05:43
companies. They get together And00:05:45
so they beat you up. all your00:05:48
friends from the yard, everyone was a yard00:05:50
community, this is not yet a group,00:05:51
it’s a yard community, and maybe00:05:53
if you’re a strategist, then you think, well, we’re00:05:55
still friends with that yard with that And let’s00:05:58
call them and together we’ll drink and00:06:00
run with sticks and I’ll at least go to them and00:06:04
then at some point this00:06:05
yard community becomes00:06:06
the basis of a group someone00:06:08
falls off there someone Who says Yes, I00:06:10
’ll go to training camps every day to00:06:12
defend the street at first, by the way, here00:06:15
they are, of course, the seventies when they remember let's00:06:17
say the subscribers of my public in general,00:06:19
those whom I passed could not be a member of00:06:22
the group run, someone is running on00:06:24
the street You're a neighbor You're just walking there00:06:26
You're coming back from school there Come00:06:28
run with us for the people You'll be in00:06:30
the mid-80s But if you're talking nonsense Pan that is, if00:06:33
you are not a representative, you will not be involved in this,00:06:36
that is, no, this is an honorable duty,00:06:38
in my book there is a mention of how the00:06:40
Adelka group was created, it’s just that the00:06:43
guys got together, they didn’t like00:06:45
the power of thieves in the area, they kind of00:06:47
drove them away once. They all went together and00:06:49
beat up someone. then of them they were the leaders00:06:52
and they became there they had such a certain00:06:54
or barbarian democratic way00:06:56
they chose the leader Yes, and probably the piece of paper00:06:59
even goes it is exactly who stands out00:07:02
someone will become the leader This is such a thing,00:07:04
inheritance of the throne is definitely not in the plan00:07:06
there, it is passed on to the eldest son and sometimes this00:07:08
duty was considered a burden for00:07:10
someone, someone didn’t want to, for example, well, how00:07:12
would everyone have their own affairs there, and this means that00:07:14
if you are the Leader of a large group, you must00:07:16
resolve some controversial and conflicts00:07:18
between there are groups in Kazan00:07:21
that in some then they absorbed the moment00:07:22
Well, even the vein This is initially about 1100:07:25
courtyards There is a Khyber courtyard, a fascist00:07:28
courtyard, by the way, if this courtyard has an internal00:07:30
conflict with this, the Leader must00:07:32
somehow solve this, but this requires00:07:34
some kind of ability, it’s just such a00:07:36
community, it’s parallel state00:07:38
It is such a state, a state, as it were, a00:07:41
shadow state which, in00:07:42
fact, practically all the functions of the state,00:07:44
it copies wars, this is foreign policy,00:07:47
there is internal politics, taxes, taxes,00:07:51
citizens are not citizens, and laws are a00:07:54
concept. These are laws, but at the same time they did not00:07:57
arise in the wake of, roughly speaking,00:07:59
romanticization there the underworld of the00:08:01
emergence of urbanization, the rapid00:08:04
urbanization of the Soviet Union, when00:08:05
rural residents move to the city,00:08:07
their mentality seems to be00:08:09
transmitted to the urban settlement,00:08:13
the city cannot yet dictate to so00:08:14
many people that we are a little00:08:17
different here, that we are they hate people from00:08:21
another area and in fact, we00:08:22
hate people at other times00:08:24
because we are so used to it, we, our village00:08:27
always didn’t like that village and we fought with them,00:08:29
then it’s still being ground down00:08:31
now to the territorial basis of00:08:33
such groups. Well, I don’t see any00:08:34
new ones emerging, at least in Moscow00:08:36
Roughly speaking, there is a memory of the people there, that there is00:08:38
some kind of Dolgoprudnaya and there00:08:42
Lytkarino, I don’t know the expectations in the area of the00:08:44
Vykhino station, but uh, really, people do00:08:47
n’t care about this anymore, that is, city life00:08:48
is a little different here, it’s nice because of00:08:51
this you can walk in the city at night00:08:52
relaxed point Or there or let your wife00:08:55
go at night and she’s calm Here we have the metro00:08:58
until what time at least up to an hour this means00:09:00
Normal people walk until one o’clock and are not00:09:03
afraid to walk around the city00:09:04
[music]00:09:08
well, these pipes of nizatsiya She was in00:09:10
many cities Why in Kazan here there is00:09:11
not a single reason to cross out, there are many of them, that00:09:14
is, in addition to urbanization, here is00:09:17
development, development is the most important thing, well, there00:09:19
was some kind of experiment in Chicago, you00:09:21
know, they built two houses and they became00:09:23
slums because there00:09:25
was such a positive public, even a00:09:26
group in Kazan, 111 yard is just00:09:29
one house 111 and it was all a slum or00:09:31
these prisoners lived there and in fact00:09:34
this house was a group there, they got into the00:09:37
crack when it was there they had to fight since the00:09:38
seventies with all the authorities who were00:09:40
there, these so-00:09:42
called krylinniks, there were00:09:44
about seven of them there eight, they were all quite00:09:47
bright characters and that’s all because there00:09:50
were a lot of cowards in the center there were cloths in00:09:52
Kazan this is the most ancient district00:09:54
which, by the way, was hosted by Pugachev at00:09:56
one time and was the birthplace of Chaliapin and in00:09:58
the seventies it was just, well, there’s a00:10:00
wooden toilet on the street at home and here he00:10:02
was the source of these, you say, there is00:10:05
a microdistrict Yes, a group was conditionally formed in it.00:10:08
Well, there they are like00:10:10
boys with similar interests. I live in a microdistrict,00:10:12
I may not be there or not, of course you can be00:10:14
more precise at some point, they do00:10:18
n’t take every And I may not be with them,00:10:21
for example, yes it may not be, if for00:10:24
example, a bespectacled person like me looks like an00:10:27
excellent student or is there with a00:10:29
violin, they won’t look at you, they00:10:32
will offend you. It’s just that you won’t00:10:33
use, of course, the benefits of a citizen of00:10:35
this lesser state because you are not00:10:38
you will appear around as a citizen if00:10:40
he does not join the group and lives in the00:10:42
block where this group exists,00:10:44
then he will either be bullied or00:10:47
not allowed to study in peace or they will00:10:49
demand money from his entire parents,00:10:52
his group will become such conditions that00:10:54
he is obliged to go there Okay Okay I’m a00:10:57
small teenager I want to join a group,00:11:00
what do I need to do to get noticed by you, do00:11:03
you communicate at school, there are00:11:06
groups anyway, wait, firstly, at00:11:08
some point when the00:11:10
younger age is recruited But usually it wasn’t like that00:11:12
unless you moved from some00:11:14
district, that is, so that you take it and00:11:16
come right away To the young people, this was an00:11:18
isolated case, naturally private Well, it is00:11:20
advisable that you go from the very beginning00:11:23
that00:11:24
Ros Ros Ros Ros and if you fit00:11:27
what parameters If you did not give00:11:30
your comrades to the police Well, some- then00:11:32
things that don’t fit according to00:11:34
the code Or, for example, you weren’t sitting on00:11:38
the counter. That is, if you’ve been00:11:40
unfastening someone for a long time, they wo00:11:41
n’t take you either because, like,00:11:45
this is a stupid act, you couldn’t00:11:46
stand up for yourself and like, well why are you00:11:48
like that, like that, yes, we won’t00:11:51
take you, that was the rule. But I don’t know how I,00:11:53
as a person, should prove myself, there00:11:55
must be some kind of athlete, you have to00:11:56
fight well, he looks at you00:11:59
first of all. Of course, if you know00:12:01
all the octaves, you take it wrong it’s important how How00:12:04
If you run fast and are very00:12:08
grateful all that stuff Okay well they00:12:10
look at the kid there some kind of check00:12:13
arranges some kind of acceptance procedure the00:12:15
first collection this is a ritual in the00:12:18
eighties there were a number of questions but00:12:21
he is also like a Ritual How to00:12:23
take Vysotskaya musical crime story00:12:26
someone asks some question about prices00:12:29
you answer it and there is approximately a template00:12:31
template answers that are there to approach00:12:34
our street Who do you know what you heard in00:12:37
some places they could offer you a00:12:39
guy to find Aktashe 80 you so00:12:43
let's now become how much we are00:12:46
we'll kill you if you decide to stay after00:12:48
that you'll stand it That is, he Let's be00:12:51
with us that is, you just don't fight back,00:12:53
you stand no In some cases you00:12:55
had to fight with someone you won't be able to00:12:58
be on pause guys with good skills it's00:13:02
unlikely you could Well, make sure00:13:04
you don’t run away, open up, maybe00:13:07
you wave ku Well, that’s enough Okay, you can clearly00:13:10
see such people, in principle, when I00:13:13
interviewed for the book, people say that00:13:16
in advance It’s clear This will be from the street And00:13:17
this will definitely never happen00:13:20
[music]00:13:22
the guy becomes a member a citizen of a00:13:26
certain state, what00:13:27
rights does he have, what are his responsibilities, what should he00:13:29
do there? It’s more like a guy’s code, he00:13:33
assumes, most likely, he shouldn’t00:13:34
do it. Well, for example, he didn’t give up, don’t00:13:37
give up, it’s clear not to cooperate.00:13:43
You should immediately become Mach, which means00:13:46
hitting you if he sends you to three letters.00:13:48
you don’t even think about it, if sector 50 is standing in front of you, you00:13:50
should still start00:13:52
fighting, you don’t have the right to break in,00:13:55
that’s running away. You should put him here00:13:57
with the elder, even if you’re walking down the street, he’s00:13:59
walking on the other side. You should, if you00:14:02
notice him, come up and say hello to him.00:14:03
hand it was important You shouldn’t say00:14:06
hello to someone who is not a member of the group because00:14:09
that’s the kind of guys even boys from00:14:10
different groups say hello to each00:14:12
other you generally do You’re like00:14:14
aristocrats only in criminal terms00:14:17
boys’ concepts are very similar to00:14:20
thieves’00:14:22
prison concept that was born back00:14:25
then in the Gulag camps they reached the00:14:27
streets of Kazan with some changes, it was allowed to00:14:30
join the army, for example, well, that is,00:14:32
the relationship with the authorities, if a thief should not00:14:35
stain himself with an oath to the state, then the00:14:38
street army was perceived as a boy as a00:14:41
school of life, it was such a00:14:44
watershed, that is, the boy00:14:45
reached the army, he became a senior And after the army he00:14:48
returned, became an old man, and then he even00:14:50
had a choice, that is, in the eighties, did00:14:51
he want to stay with the group,00:14:53
or, for example, would he go to work at a factory,00:14:55
join the ordinary life of an ordinary person there,00:14:59
get married, have children, become a senior foreman,00:15:02
this is a construction plant Well, that’s how it00:15:05
was Or could further So I00:15:07
will functionally go to training camps. You say there is00:15:09
street control. Well, at some point it00:15:11
becomes a very cruel thing. Yes,00:15:13
because these are fights with reinforcement, that is,00:15:15
there you look at documentary footage. Yes, there00:15:17
were dead victims there in the Soviet Union.00:15:19
Well that is, people00:15:21
kill, we will suffer heavy00:15:24
damage Where does this cruelty come from, then00:15:25
it turns out that teenagers are always cruel,00:15:27
that they simply do not evaluate the actions of a00:15:29
scarecrow, remember,00:15:32
go, teenagers are cruel, these are like00:15:35
prosperous teenagers in this film That00:15:38
is, in principle, it says that00:15:41
people of the community sometimes turn off such a00:15:43
moral and ethical assessment of your00:15:45
actions and you follow the instructions of the leader00:15:47
or whatever you may be, I think that you00:15:49
do it yourself. But in fact,00:15:51
someone decides for you in this community00:15:53
group and there is also management there.00:15:55
Each age is older if00:15:57
You need to ensure that there is discipline00:16:00
so that the exact number of people is at00:16:02
the training camp, if there are not enough00:16:04
of you you are punished, they beat the whole age,00:16:06
or so that during the war, for example, there00:16:08
would be this assembly tool, bricks00:16:11
there, balls were prepared, synchros were prepared00:16:14
for those who were installing for this mount00:16:16
Here is such fittings Yes, such Construction00:16:18
Well, even such Well, which one did I get?00:16:21
Is there such a thing or00:16:22
is it just wooden, just Fists at00:16:25
some point were not enough00:16:27
precisely because of a teenager, someone00:16:29
once came running with fists and there were00:16:30
guys charged with, well, next time for00:16:33
the guys with weapons, of course,00:16:37
again for those who haven’t read the book yes00:16:40
Or not really what a run00:16:42
is ran This means that you00:16:44
ran Your age is usually super00:16:48
it’s not the youngest age and those who00:16:50
Maybe there 1600:16:52
ran at the enemy in place their00:16:55
gatherings or simply on their territory if00:16:57
at that moment they don’t have gatherings and00:16:59
you’re trying to find members of the group.00:17:01
Well, that is, the elder told you to00:17:02
run so that someone would00:17:04
die there. Sometimes he runs and doesn’t00:17:07
find anyone and gets it, well, as if she I00:17:10
actually got it sometimes and didn’t00:17:11
get it, well, that is, they didn’t00:17:13
decide at all that it’s an unfamiliar face,00:17:14
you come up and ask, he must00:17:16
answer honestly, honestly, when you see a crowd of00:17:19
aggressive dudes, there were no dudes,00:17:22
10 guys, and you see that they are strangers, they are00:17:27
those local areas You can let’s assume00:17:29
that they probably came to beat you sometimes. There was a00:17:33
case in the euphoria club, also 90, the00:17:36
high people would come there to take revenge on the Pervougorskys and the00:17:39
club was located on the territory00:17:41
of the Pervougorskys and there, near the entrance to the club,00:17:43
there were three guys who lived in the first00:17:46
city and they asked you where it was from. From the first00:17:48
mountains it was mistakenly they were00:17:51
members of the group, but three of them were00:17:53
shot there at once with various ones00:17:56
taken00:17:58
to the hospital,00:18:00
one was given emergency00:18:03
room in the hospital, he died,00:18:04
there were exceptions to the rules when people00:18:07
tried to deceive, even if you are a member00:18:10
of the group, you see you are talking about00:18:12
it, they learned about it00:18:15
in disgrace And if an adult,00:18:19
for example, a man a00:18:22
situation that shows how this was00:18:24
treated then, that is, you are escorting a00:18:27
girl who lives on the territory of00:18:29
another group with which you do not have a00:18:32
very good relationship, while you are walking the girl and they00:18:35
cannot touch you. Because you00:18:36
are walking with the girl, of course, back00:18:38
to the stop for your escorting her dad,00:18:41
for example, that is, they don’t touch dad00:18:43
because dad is an adult, he’s from this00:18:45
world and he doesn’t concern him with that, yes. Well,00:18:47
somewhere around the 90s, well, that’s how the00:18:50
state works within the state. But00:18:53
how did the main one look at it? This00:18:54
state missed this00:18:57
formation of these groups or then00:18:58
even the policeman of00:19:00
the eighties couldn’t cope, we ran at00:19:03
each other wall to wall what he00:19:05
tells us What kind of teenagers are00:19:06
adults as soon as they leave the world of00:19:09
teenagers he just doesn’t notice it Well,00:19:12
the men came there with a bruise,00:19:15
everyone always had bruises00:19:18
someone - then beaten Well, the boys got into a fight Well, it’s00:19:21
as if the hydraulics always didn’t understand00:19:24
the scale of the problem. I00:19:26
even describe in the book a case that a00:19:28
boy stopped going to school, one of my00:19:30
heroes because they00:19:33
arrived there and came to another school; this00:19:35
school was located on the territory of another00:19:36
group he doesn’t go to classes00:19:39
very often, almost everyone even comes because he00:19:43
very often left lessons, but00:19:45
I was silently afraid at first, I thought he knew everything,00:19:48
they could even kill him, because00:19:50
you can’t call people that way, so00:19:52
I was very afraid and said that I was00:19:56
missing a lot of lessons especially the00:19:59
last lessons because after it’s00:20:02
empty and00:20:05
the action ca00:20:16
n’t escape anywhere, they00:20:22
beat you alone00:20:28
because there are00:20:31
no groups in our school. We don’t have and00:20:35
haven’t and won’t speak to the school principal,00:20:53
they pull them out, they tried if the parents00:20:55
were some kind of officials or there was00:20:57
one guy at the factory who told us that there were00:20:59
Girls the elders who, if someone00:21:01
got into the group, they immediately called in. The class00:21:03
teacher00:21:05
immediately volunteered and there, if the parents00:21:08
could, they don’t know, it’s not house arrest,00:21:11
but somehow they tried, with a strong desire, the00:21:14
parents could get their beloved00:21:17
child out of the group, but more often than not, the00:21:19
parents simply didn’t knew about this00:21:24
correctly, I understand that, roughly speaking,00:21:27
the state lost the fight for the minds of00:21:29
these boys at some point. That is,00:21:30
they didn’t have them. Other interesting I don’t00:21:34
know. You couldn’t go to a sports00:21:35
school to study Youth policy of the00:21:37
Soviet Union at that time it was already00:21:39
like that The authority of the Komsomol in general was in00:21:41
October, it was still held on by inertia00:21:45
because I remember what pleasure00:21:46
it gave, but only the age of the00:21:48
country, if I have a tie,00:21:50
that means I have a completely certain00:21:52
number of years, but if I’m already an adult00:21:53
and the first year you wear it like that, and then of00:21:56
course in pocket at first, look at00:22:00
everything, I achieved this,00:22:03
he said00:22:05
the badge, in general, also spoke about this roughly,00:22:07
well, these00:22:10
organizations did not have any authority at that time, in00:22:12
fact, it was a Parallel00:22:14
organization in parallel, the authority00:22:16
of course And again, the social elevator of at least00:22:19
some school could not to be so00:22:21
social, it will still be in parallel00:22:22
if you and if you have success, especially in00:22:27
sports, then you could be exempted from00:22:28
training camps, well, let’s say if you had training00:22:30
that day, you could not go then at00:22:32
some point 90 by the way, younger00:22:34
age actually shifted this at00:22:35
some point, the training camp turned into a00:22:39
sports training Why Because,00:22:40
well, no one will disperse the sports training00:22:42
Well, as if this is what we00:22:44
were doing in sports, we are playing this football, the police00:22:46
knew that, of course, what they are doing there, you00:22:48
can Well, in some local police officer he has00:22:49
some districts could know everyone for the00:22:51
recount and say from there if it’s a00:22:54
good district policeman who knows his00:22:56
pasta Well, we have God that these people00:22:59
are gathering Yes and well, that is, they are discussing00:23:02
some kind of action gathering would be a tedious00:23:05
activity In the eighties Well, that is,00:23:07
two or three hours You are there every day for six, uh,00:23:10
why spend so much time, then you00:23:13
realized it. Let’s say the asphalt period00:23:15
when I went through generally, that is, just00:23:17
Let’s get together several times so as not to00:23:19
forget that, well, three times a week there for00:23:22
half an hour and 40 minutes, we chatted, we condemned the work, we00:23:26
gave instructions, Everyone went well, Well or00:23:29
there may be some kind of extraordinary decision to00:23:31
punish someone. And how the asphalt00:23:34
period grew into some kind of base00:23:36
for a new criminal business there,00:23:39
probably as at some point there is00:23:41
such a mythological case that somewhere in00:23:43
ninety-two and three such things took place of the00:23:46
citywide team who said00:23:48
all the asphalt, we00:23:49
stop starting to nail down the commercial00:23:52
streets, they are no longer fighting, and so conventionally,00:23:55
some streets even stopped00:23:56
really fighting, but at the same time it was still00:23:58
carried by a00:24:01
criminal group, it didn’t disappear, it didn’t00:24:03
disappear into thin air, it’s already enough for the money for the00:24:05
money because this is no longer a00:24:07
symbolic war. Now it has become00:24:08
much more bloody. The groups have00:24:11
become a breeding ground for00:24:13
new organized criminal groups. They began to divide into brigades,00:24:16
and also at some00:24:18
point. It has already become clear to me that I don’t00:24:20
have to be part of the brigadier.00:24:23
groups, I have00:24:26
these and so there were prefabricated teams,00:24:28
it’s just me and these and we are engaged in00:24:30
such and such a criminal business,00:24:31
sometimes not very criminal, at some00:24:33
point the business could be gray And at00:24:35
some point people began to be00:24:37
legalized because it turned out00:24:39
that it was easier, easier, safer. Why00:24:42
kill or take someone away when the business00:24:45
went on without it? And what00:24:47
happened to the majority, that is, the majority of00:24:49
people who did not become businessmen on00:24:51
their VKontakte public page, I asked this00:24:54
question repeatedly We discussed and00:24:56
found out that most of the00:25:00
cemetery, it’s understandable that00:25:04
these started until now in the 90s, then the00:25:06
accompanying such such losses are00:25:09
if people sat and got acquainted with the00:25:12
Russian Tatar system, then they00:25:14
along with this tuberculosis, mainly00:25:16
cirrhosis of the liver, these are the main fatal00:25:19
third heart attack, of course they drink a lot00:25:21
the main work as a taxi driver Builder00:25:23
security guards for some who didn’t sleep on the00:25:26
HPG list because they don’t always take you00:25:29
if you have a deadline or something00:25:31
in between And those at the top are a small00:25:34
small percentage of people, that is, this is the00:25:37
percentage of some successful people00:25:39
who could go because at00:25:42
some point the state began to00:25:43
imprison somewhere in ninety-nine, a00:25:46
group goes like this, a friend of a00:25:49
group gives someone there a leader00:25:51
for life the entire Backbone for long terms,00:25:54
that is, people people began to leave this00:25:56
in business of course Even if you have already left00:25:58
in business, they can still still00:26:00
now group Pervo-Gorkovsky for the00:26:03
second time already, by the way, an00:26:04
interesting point They once had this00:26:07
trial, that is, the organized crime group of the first Gorky, they00:26:10
got away with everything fine the second time00:26:12
now it will be00:26:16
you say there conditionally if they give00:26:19
long sentences, then people move away from it. But00:26:22
in your book it is written in great detail00:26:24
about the case of a blunder, the end of the 70s, the second00:26:28
half of the seventies, and there is a death00:26:30
sentence, that is, they give the death penalty there, but00:26:31
at the same time, the groups do not influence anything00:26:34
like mushrooms, they still00:26:35
grow especially and the group. Probably00:26:38
this is also one of the reasons why in00:26:41
Kazan Kazansky because it00:26:43
was so promoted also to such00:26:46
mythological people because00:26:48
heat control plant heat control00:26:51
therefore the name of the group was in the00:26:53
seventy-eighth year they were approaching00:26:55
the territory in the Tatar group, they00:26:59
were approaching then it was already possible with a00:27:01
gunshot with a killed pensioner and It00:27:05
turned out that this umach is why00:27:08
we told about this in the voice of America. And if00:27:10
in the voice of America they said that well, the USSR00:27:12
It was such a signal to fight,00:27:14
the shooting began, they began to go to the city already00:27:18
we were never there again, they started00:27:22
looking for something somewhere to00:27:26
do something, and there they00:27:30
actually put two of them beyond punishment, then00:27:33
two were pardoned because you know for00:27:35
what reason it’s interesting that so many00:27:37
teenagers will be shot, 4 teenagers00:27:39
decided too strongly that only00:27:41
two can be expanded because there00:27:43
one of these Maslenitsa people there was even00:27:45
he was either on the verge of being a00:27:48
minor or not00:27:49
even an adult yet, the00:27:52
maximum sentences then were 15 because00:27:55
Criminal00:27:56
97 could only be put in prison for amateurs00:27:59
for 15 or then00:28:01
Shoot But this is not for anyone frightened00:28:03
the groups continued to grow, one00:28:05
note in total came out. It was so small.00:28:12
And those who,00:28:14
like I heard, that there was such a group00:28:18
wore jeans, the fashion of the gangsters of the00:28:20
late 80s, it was completely different, they00:28:23
rode motorcycles and shot at the00:28:26
cops with pistols like this. This is how I was as a child. I heard,00:28:29
well, it’s more likely that you think, No big deal00:28:32
in gangs, even if the series is a mess, it’s like it was in00:28:35
Kazan, that’s how it was perceived.00:28:37
Yes, it’s a bummer, and this is it. Well, if you’re a00:28:41
boy, you tell me something like that, what will he say?00:28:42
Never mind, I want it00:28:44
to work. On the contrary, they say that it happened00:28:47
There was such a calm in 197800:28:49
after the trial for a year and then, just00:28:52
like mushrooms, everything began to grow at first,00:28:55
every street was divided into something there,00:28:57
more than 60 groups divided the city into00:29:00
spheres of influence,00:29:04
this is an epidemic of some kind of mass00:29:07
savagery and it’s spontaneous, sometimes there are people00:29:12
The KGB is a myth, but in reality, you’re00:29:14
listening, we came together, we realized that00:29:18
we need protection. Because there are a lot of00:29:21
aggressive groups around and we decided00:29:23
to gather ourselves.00:29:26
Maybe I’m wrong, but I got the00:29:28
feeling that despite the fact that the phenomenon00:29:30
was very big, right here very large00:29:33
Yes, in fact, he was00:29:34
captured there for at least three decades, but00:29:36
nevertheless, not much was known about him,00:29:39
that is, some documentary films were made in the Soviet Union, then00:29:40
later, it00:29:42
seems to me, apart from your book, there00:29:45
were no major studies00:29:46
how it seems Why is it a mistaken opinion00:29:50
that teenage groups00:29:52
are generally studied in such a way as the Kazan00:29:55
phenomenon, this did not exist at all, neither Russian00:29:59
history is not in criminology. I think, too,00:30:01
at the moment when they learned in Moscow00:30:04
that there are such teenage groups,00:30:05
that this is a problem at the level of one00:30:08
autonomous there were no republics of Tatarstan, the00:30:11
Union Republic had autonomy, what00:30:13
was done in 1986,00:30:14
the Ministry of Internal Affairs commissioned sociologists from Kazan00:30:18
University, there was such a group of Salagaevs,00:30:19
they started researching, they00:30:21
interviewed this group for a very long time,00:30:23
literally five years ago,00:30:26
it stopped. Well, firstly, the head of00:30:29
the composition has already died and those guys who00:30:32
wrote dissertations with him together, all sorts of00:30:34
very interesting checkers, they seemed to00:30:37
change the topic; there was a budget for research00:30:40
and she Therefore, from the very beginning, the00:30:44
first book was practically very well researched. In the00:30:46
ninety-first year, Ageev’s love00:30:48
Kazan phenomenon myth of reality was a00:30:49
series Deputy Chairman of the Supreme Court of00:30:53
Tatarstan Maxim Belyaev and there usually00:30:56
was a Shipchitsky co-author, then he fell off00:30:57
from him and there was such a straight-up00:30:59
skull-scientist Kazan Bandit00:31:00
Tatarstan There it’s like a digest of the00:31:02
most interesting and high-profile cases and00:31:05
based on the actual judicial cases of all sorts00:31:07
or there conversations with investigators here00:31:09
for Elf Well, in general, such interesting00:31:12
books or at four by the way, then the Minister of the00:31:15
Ministry of Internal Affairs e with the solution Safarov wrote Well, that00:31:18
is, more precisely, they wrote for him like00:31:20
Brezhnev before, remember the Republican00:31:22
Republican Safarov Yes, which00:31:24
then00:31:26
went away quite loudly was such a precedent VVG00:31:30
distant When the guy died from a bottle of00:31:34
champagne, you don’t want to dirty even the servants00:31:37
to talk about Safarov, then they removed the truth, how00:31:39
they removed him to the Minnikhanov administration, they removed him, they transferred00:31:42
him, they moved him. Yes, there he writes00:31:45
a book called very loudly the decline00:31:47
of the Kazan phenomenon, he tells how it00:31:49
seems they fought with the groups,00:31:53
also as if a response to question, the average person00:31:55
believes that the group has not been around for a long time,00:31:57
in the nineties it’s just that they are not in Kazan.00:31:59
Well, in fact, they just00:32:01
changed their appearance, that is, these are no longer there.00:32:04
And such gopniks like the Eighties00:32:07
who won’t let you pass somewhere in the00:32:09
area there too there are on the outskirts, but that00:32:12
is, the main activity is, well,00:32:13
just criminal activity, and00:32:15
criminal activity doesn’t even00:32:16
require any kind of poster, look,00:32:18
Hello, I’m a criminal and I have a00:32:21
community, let’s No, it’s just that the guys00:32:23
quietly do something there,00:32:25
they meet somewhere- then socialization at such a00:32:28
level in the yard, it also goes on and00:32:31
money is collected in the dorm of age00:32:32
official Tatarstan is not proud of This00:32:35
topic is a spoke in my wheels This is00:32:38
such a legacy of the Soviet Union in terms of the00:32:40
fact that there is a Federal Center but00:32:42
I want to embarrass myself in front of Moscow00:32:44
Well so the groups,00:33:04
although everyone was standing, everyone was crying,00:33:07
but no one said anything, everyone was silent, but is it00:33:09
possible, I don’t know now, or in00:33:12
some near future, a repetition of00:33:14
something like that, they often compare00:33:16
there, I don’t know, with the Aue movement of romanticization,00:33:18
there I have it, it’s different She but rather,00:33:22
it’s imaginary. As you know, there are00:33:25
imaginary friends, I don’t understand everything, there’s no00:33:27
such movement,00:33:28
it’s somewhere closer to Siberia, there it’s somewhere,00:33:33
maybe there’s something similar00:33:35
to a subculture. Well, more likely, it’s a00:33:37
network subculture that someone00:33:40
likes from teenagers to say these00:33:42
letters Well, look, the movement is called00:33:44
extremist What is extremism is00:33:47
when someone tries to violate the borders of the00:33:49
Russian Federation and Aue00:33:53
12-year-old boys are violating the integrity of00:33:56
the Russian Federation, it’s just funny, my00:33:59
subscribers are laughing out loud,00:34:01
and the secret police officers, well, that’s what- then00:34:04
anime clowns cosplayers are guys who00:34:07
cosplay prisons prison subculture,00:34:10
roughly speaking, it’s all nothing more than00:34:15
this, and there was blood of Tatar00:34:17
boys and Russian boys and00:34:19
alleys in the cemetery, it’s all serious00:34:21
[music]00:34:22
this is a subculture like this, it’s more likely for00:34:26
some lazy investigators00:34:28
who will go to catch criminals where will00:34:30
I go and go on the Internet and go get into the00:34:33
public I found provoked teenagers and00:34:36
imprisoned Well, it’s still possible Do you00:34:39
think a repetition in some way apparently00:34:40
maybe no no Because society00:34:43
has changed Because society00:34:44
has changed because here this is a move from a00:34:47
village to a city that happened for many years, if00:34:50
even your father or grandfather00:34:53
adhered to such practices 100,00000:34:56
now, having lived in the city for several00:34:58
generations, you understand that the00:35:00
values here are different. Of course, even00:35:04
the crumbs remain, that is, the guys look like the00:35:06
youth there are hipster, maybe there is a00:35:09
tunnel in their ears,00:35:11
maybe maybe you can look bright you can00:35:14
look unusual for your clothes you’re unlikely to00:35:17
ask for clarification How do you have a light at00:35:20
the end of the tunnel Yes, that’s who00:35:23
one of the characters said00:35:25
[music]00:35:37
[music]Description:
Роберт Гараев — писатель, исследователь, журналист и музыкант. Он также является автором книги «Слово Пацана. Криминальный Татарстан» — одной из самых больших работ, посвященных разгулу подростковых группировок и ОПГ в советской Казани в 70-е и 80-е. Этот период также известен как «казанский феномен». Учитывая, что сам Гараев также успел побывать членом одной из банд, в этом интервью замредактора «АиФ» Владимир Шушкин решил узнать, что стало причиной возникновения таких группировок, почему разгул подростковых ОПГ начался именно в Казани и может ли ситуация повториться уже в XXI веке. Группа Роберта Гараева в VK, посвящённая «казанскому феномену»: https://vk.com/kazan_opg Таймкоды: 00:17 — Гость интервью 01:50 — Что такое казанский феномен? 04:19 — Как возникли группировки? 10:24 — Кого не брали в банду? 12:09 — Испытания для новых членов группировки 13:29 — Кодекс пацана 15:08 — Откуда такая жестокость? 18:50 — Почему формирование группировок не сразу заметили? 20:50 — Можно ли вытащить ребенка из группировки? 21:25 — Группировки — ответ на провал молодежной политики? 23:33 — Как подростковые банды переросли в ОПГ? 24:46 — Где члены банд сейчас? 26:16 — «Тяп-ляп» — первая ОПГ СССР 28:01 — Почему расстрел преступников спровоцировал рост группировок? 29:26 — Изучали ли феномен еще в СССР? 33:09 — АУЕ — новый казанский феномен? 34:38 — Может ли история повториться? Присоединяйтесь к нам: ✅Наш сайт - https://aif.ru/ ✅ВКонтакте - https://vk.com/aif_ru ✅Одноклассники - https://ok.ru/aifru ✅Twitter - https://twitter.com/aifonline Телефон редакции: +7 (495) 646 57 57 Телефон рекламной службы: +7 (495) 783 83 57 Адрес редакции: ул. Мясницкая, д. 42
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